episode
111
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Personal Growth

The Enneagram For Moms—How to Transforms Parenting Triggers & Blind Spots Into Growth & Connection With Beth McCord

Episode Notes

Do you ever get activated by your kids—even when they’re not really doing anything wrong?It happens to the best of parents! Today’s episode, featuring renowned Enneagram expert, Beth McCord, is such an incredibly helpful and practical conversation about how to transform triggers into opportunities for health and connection.

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Here’s what we cover:‍

1. How the Enneagram helped her stop comparing herself to other moms

2. A step by step process for what to do when you get activated by your kids

3. Why neither shaming yourself or blaming others works

4. How her family’s love for debate triggered childhood wounds & how she worked through it

5. How and when to talk about the Enneagram with your kids

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‍Thanks to our sponsors:

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Additional Resources:

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‍Related Episodes:

  • Episode 108: Inside Out—Internal Family Systems, Therapy, and High-Performing Protectors with Jenna Riemersma
  • Episode 109: Healing Burdens From the Past—How to Overcome Childhood Wounds and Heal Your Younger Self with Tammy Sollenberger
  • Episode 110: How to Be Wise When People Are Difficult—Biblical Strategies For Keeping Your Emotional Health & Mental Sanity
  • Episode 111: The Enneagram For Moms—How to Transforms Parenting Triggers & Blind Spots Into Growth & Connection With Beth McCord

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Music by Andy Luiten

Sound editing by Kelly Kramarik

© 2024 Alison Cook. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Please do not copy or share the contents of this webpage without permission from the author.

While Dr. Cook is a counselor, the content of this podcast and any of the products provided by Dr. Cook are not specific counseling advice nor are they a substitute for individual counseling. The content and products provided on this podcast are for informational purposes only.‍

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Transcript:

Alison Cook: Hey everyone. And welcome back to this week's episode of The Best of You Podcast. I am so thrilled you are here today. We have a very special guest joining us who I know you're going to love. She's amazing. She's so wise, so practical, and provides such great illustrations about how to apply the work that she does.

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Together, we're going to dive into a topic that I find super helpful and incredibly practical. It's the Enneagram, especially as it applies to the work of being a mom. Now, before we get started with today's episode, if you're not familiar with the Enneagram, please go back and listen to Episode 52, where we provide a complete overview of each of the nine types. 

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You can also check out Episode 109, where my guest Tammy Sollenberger talks about her Enneagram number as one part of who she is and how she learned to integrate it with her overall story. These background episodes will give you a solid foundation for our conversation today. 

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Our guest today, Beth McCord, is a renowned Enneagram coach, speaker, and author. She has spent over 20 years studying and teaching the Enneagram and her passion for helping people understand themselves and others through this powerful tool is so incredible. Beth's approach is both compassionate and insightful, and she integrates all of her work with the Enneagram with a gospel centered perspective. Everything Beth does is infused with a Christ centered approach. 

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The other thing I love about Beth, in addition to being a great friend and an amazing person, is that she integrates the Enneagram with an awareness of the internal parts of our souls. In fact, she and I have conducted a workshop together that combined the Enneagram with parts work, which has been incredibly transformative for so many people. 

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Her previous book, More Than Your Number, lays out this integrated process of viewing your Enneagram number as one part of who you are, really powerfully.

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Today, Beth is here to talk to us about her brand new book dropping this week. It's called Enneagram for Moms. This book is an absolute treat. A game-changer for mothers everywhere. It offers such a unique perspective on how to understand your own Enneagram type and it can help you navigate the challenges and joys and struggles of motherhood wisely.

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Whether you're dealing with the daily stressors of parenting, whether you're trying to seek greater understanding of your children, or you're trying to understand your own reactions to your children, Beth's insights are so helpful.

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Beth McCord is an accomplished Enneagram speaker, author, coach, and teacher with over two decades of experience. And if you're interested in learning more about your own Enneagram number, please go to Beth's website. It's www.yourenneagramcoach.com. There's a free assessment. It's one of the best assessments I've found. It really helped me identify my own Enneagram number. 

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You can go to her website and take that Enneagram assessment for free. I am so thrilled to bring you my conversation with Beth McCord.

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Alison Cook: I'm so thrilled to have you here today, Beth. I'm such a big fan of you, your work, of you as a person. It's been so fun to get to know you these past few years, and this is your first time on the podcast. So thanks for being here.

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Beth: I know. Oh, my pleasure. Yes. like I told you earlier, I'm in the middle of your book. I'm really enjoying it and can't wait to keep plugging along and seeing how it's going to be so helpful and effective for myself. So thank you for writing the book.

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Alison Cook: Oh I love that. I learned so much from this one, this new book. We tend to trade books and read each other's books, and there's so much synergy and so much overlap in what we both do from different angles.

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I am so excited to dive into The Enneagram for Moms. This is so fresh. I learned so much from this. I've read a lot about the enneagram, a lot of your work, and this is a really beautiful, unique take on it that's so gentle and so wise. I want to start with your story, because I know so much of your work grows out of your own experience of learning and growing.

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As a young mom, you talk about some of the things that were hard for you, that were challenging for you. Put us back there as a young mom–what are some of the things you wrestled with and struggled with early on that you couldn't have even anticipated? 

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Beth: Yeah, because I was all about wanting to be a mom. Like that's what I want to be. I really thought I was going to be amazing. I don't know if I would have said easy, but amazing. But I didn't know myself really well when I started to have kids. The enneagram didn't come into my life until my daughter was about one years old and she's now 23.

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So when I started with the kids, I really didn't know, but I was really struggling with a lot of type nine tendencies, which makes sense, where I was consumed with people-pleasing to various levels. My heart felt like, oh, I'm being, so accommodating and helpful, and I'm wanting my kids to be happy.

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In one sense it is a great quality, but it also, when it's all consuming, you can't make children happy most of the time. I took that as I must be being a bad mom. Or why can't I figure this out? Or why is he crying all the time? Then I would go out to the playground because Jeff was in seminary at the time, and I'd go out to the playground and the kids at that point were still really little.

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I was observing moms that had a little bit older kids, running around the playground, but they seemed perfectly amazing–all of them. Now they all were totally different, some were super creative, some were really soft with their kids, some were gregarious, some were creative.

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There's a wide range, but I would look at all of them and admire them and in my mind, be like, why can't I be a great mom like that? I would come home and I would tell Jeff what I was feeling. Thankfully, he was really in tune with who I was, probably way more than I was with myself. 

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He said, Beth, you're bringing all of these incredible aspects of each of these moms, which by the way, Beth, they're probably putting on their best performance when they're at the playground. But you're bringing in all of these incredible qualities of each of them and creating one big super mom that you think you should be and live up to.

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That was a big turning point for me. It helped me to realize, oh, yeah. I didn't have the language back then, but had I had the enneagram language, I'd have been like, you're right. I am not a type 8. I am not a type 4. I am not a type 5. Those aren't the paths for me. That's okay. God created me to be this mom for these children.

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But I didn't have the understanding back then. So I was highly anxious and really in that comparison world, thinking I should be this or should be that. Even in the Christian world, there are a lot of shoulds. We didn't have social media back then, but I'm sure had I been on social media, I would have been swallowed up with, oh, wait, I should be like that and this and that.

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I would have been pulled in a thousand different directions. That's probably one of the biggest reasons why I struggled so much. I know a lot of moms do too, not being a type nine though, as type nines definitely want to be a little bit of all things. I think all of us moms struggle to some degree with either comparison or what is the best right way to be a parent.

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We have our own framework in our mind that we're trying to live up to. This book is really written out of an overflow of my own heart for myself and what I struggled with. The things I wish I would have been told or brought to my attention back in the day, because if we live in fear and shame, guilt, it is not going to be the best way to parent.

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I want moms to first recognize that God created you uniquely to be you, your personality type for your kiddos. You have your own story. You have your own way of seeing the world. We need to do our own work with the framework God gave us, the way we see the world in light of God, of his truth for our kiddos.

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I'm a type 9, but if I'm sitting next to three other type 9s, they might have kids that are completely different Enneagram types, and have completely different needs. Their story is unique to them. I wanted this book to be full of non-judgment, grace, receptivity, attunement, validation.

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Like I see you for the type you are. Here are your great strengths. This is where you excel. Yes, when you're struggling, yeah, here's what it looks like. But not to bring shame, not to bring condemnation, but as a rumble strip on the highway that alerts you, that you know what? Yeah. When you're doing this, you're probably unaware.

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You're starting to get into an autopilot mode and you're veering off course, and we want you to be alert, not to shame, because if we shame ourselves and guilt ourselves, it's like taking the wheel and plowing right into the ditch. I know I do it all the time. Versus, oh, okay. Yep. I'm struggling or, yep, that's a pattern I have.

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But God has also given me healthy qualities, and I'm gonna get back into the healthy direction for my personality type, not the type everyone else wants me to be, or the type I think I should be. So that's really the backbone of why I wrote the book–was to really write it to my younger self.

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Alison Cook: I love that. I think one of the things I love about the book and about the enneagram and about your work is, it's a naming tool. In I Shouldn’t Feel This Way, there's this sort of meta “name, frame, brave”. When I'm listening to you, I can imagine when you're this young mom and I want to hear when you got introduced to the Enneagram, but it's such a fantastic naming device.

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This is a description of a personality type. That's different from this other mom I see on the playground. Even right there, there's a name for something that helps you to frame that. Okay, I may never be the mom who is, whatever the thing is, and I love in the book, you really go through that.

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This is one of the things you're really gifted at, is using that naming device again without shame, but then to show that metaphor of the rumble strip. This is where I'm doing really well as a type nine. This is what it looks like when I'm starting to hit those rough patches. Here are the behaviors that start to bubble to the surface. Tell me a little bit about, first of all, when you discovered that, how did that come into your life? That language, that naming tool?

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Beth: Yeah. So I would say the naming tool really came in with the enneagram because I didn't even really know what it looks like to go inward. I got married at 20, I had Nate at 23, and Libby at 25. I was super young. I'm living life on autopilot and some days, if not a lot of days, I was careening off course and into the ditch and then throwing up my hands going, what is going on?

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Why? Why is it like this? Jeff was too, even though we were best friends and still are and love each other, we had a lot of turbulence and he needed to get to know his own self, but I needed understanding. So in 2001 is when I was introduced to the enneagram, way back before it was a popular thing, and I devoured it. I see patterns, especially with the Enneagram, really easily. it made sense. 

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I tell people, it's like when you see the movie, The Matrix, and there's that screen with the green digits going down, and people are seeing something, and you're like, what are you seeing? That's how I feel with the Enneagram. I see it. I get it. I found my type right away. It was so relieving. Now, a lot of people can think, “I don't want to be labeled”. 

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The Enneagram doesn't label you. It helps you to understand the framework through which, or the lens through which you see the world, you interpret the world and why you react to it through your feelings, thoughts, and behaviors.

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So if I'm going to operate like an algorithm, I'm going to operate in a very specific way and that way can be either healthy all the way to unhealthy. But that is the lens and the path through which I see. And then I can go, oh, okay. These are like my bumper lanes. This is Beth McCord.

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So as a mom, I'm going to have these tendencies, healthy tendencies, less healthy and unhealthy tendencies. Using it with the gospel was so helpful. I remember one time, and I hope this is really encouraging to moms, because what usually happens is we start reading the enneagram and it's oooh, this is amazing. It's like a camera in my soul, like, how do they know it? 

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But then all of a sudden we start seeing the weaknesses or the liabilities of our personality. And it becomes a neon sign, like it's all we can see. All of a sudden shame and guilt come in. I don't like my personality. Why is this so hard? That's very natural. 

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But when you bring the gospel in, what you recognize is, Christ has not only forgiven my past, present and future sins, he has put on me his righteousness so that when God looks at me, he sees me whole and complete in Christ. When you have that framework in your mind, then when you look at the levels of health for your enneagram type, and it's hard to look at the average to the unhealthy, you recognize I am always his beloved child, no matter where I'm at in these levels of health. My status and my relationship with Christ never changes.

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So that helps me to look at that with a lot more grace and freedom–to know I am going to mess up on this side of heaven. He's not surprised by that. In fact, that's why he came. It's also not freedom to go and have a bad day, two bad kids, deal with it. No, he calls us to renew ourselves, to renew our mind, to become more like Christ, but he's the one that's going to work in and through us when we surrender and depend on him.

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By looking at the different levels and I see myself, let's say in the average, in the unhealthy place, that's the time to not shame, not guilt, but to come to Christ and say, I need you again. I need you to renew me. I need you to help me to come back to a healthier place for the personality type that you have created me to be for myself and my kiddos.

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That's the first step of him working in and through us. It's that dependency and surrender that he is really looking for. Our mustering up and pulling our bootstraps up. We've all tried that. It is literally surrendering, depending on him. That's the first step. Now, of course, we do our work for sure. But it's that position that we come in and really enjoying the personality that he gave us. Because our personality is a reflection of him when we're at our healthiest. We can champion ourselves because he's the one that designed us.

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Alison Cook: I love that you focus so much, you've even developed this framework, this awareness framework that really emphasizes everything you're saying. This self awareness component of the enneagram is almost like this mirror. I love what you're saying that when we pair it with that sense of our belovedness, it allows us to even look at those parts of the reflections in the mirror that aren't so wonderful. 

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It'd be really hard to do that apart from the love of God. So walk us through that. Walk us through that aware framework as moms, as parents, how does that help us? Even in your own life, as you began to implement your understanding of yourself as a type nine, how did that becoming more aware change your parenting?

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Beth: Yeah, so AWARE, the acronym AWARE that we use, if you've been in any of our books, it's there everywhere. So the first letter is A, which is Awaken. The second letter is W for Welcome. then A is for Ask. R is Receive and E is Engage, so I'll walk through those real quickly. 

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A is awaken to yourself, your thoughts, your feelings, and your body inclinations. They're all going to give us this alert system, what's going on. As moms, we get activated a lot. Now it can go into that trigger mode. Maybe you have trauma in your past and maybe something's even triggering you, but we get activated all the time. I want moms to hear first and foremost, getting activated and triggered is not wrong or a sin.

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It's life. It's what we do with it that makes the difference. So we want to become awakened to what activates and triggers us and why. That's what the Enneagram is all about. Why is that triggering you? It helps us to know why we think, feel, and behave. What are those core motivations behind the scene? You guys will learn all of that in the book. What are those core motivations for all nine types? 

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But we want to become awakened to it. So for me, as a type nine mom, I wanted peace and harmony. How is this so hard? Can't everyone be happy and get along? I have this vision and it would be super easy. I'll make everyone happy. And it's going to be great. That's not how life is. When the kids would whine or fight or struggle, I would get all anxious inside and almost want to force people to be happy or force people to be peaceful. 

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I had to awaken those tendencies, but then the second step is welcome. I needed to welcome the understanding of who I am and why I'm doing these things with grace and compassion to be receptive and nonjudgmental of myself. That those two are huge steps. then. Once you're in that place of not judging or criticizing yourself, which, hey, it is really hard, that is a very hard place to be.

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But when we're there, we can start to ask, that's the second A, ask for what is true, whether that's getting feedback from people, maybe it's reading a book. I'm telling you, your books, all three of them have been revolutionary to my life. Boundaries For Your Soul is when I contacted you. I'm like, I have got to know this person. 

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We'll ask for what's true. And then we go into the R, which is receive. Receive what's true, which can be really hard. That's where the Enneagram comes in because we're seeing our great strengths and our weaknesses, and we've got to receive that. If we're in that non judgmental state, and we know that Christ has us, it's a lot easier. It's not easy, but it'll be easier. 

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Then we can move into the last letter, which is E. That's where we can now engage in life and relationships in a new way, because we're seeing things differently. We understand life differently, are more self regulated because we understand first and foremost, we are beloved, we're safe, we're secure in the finished work of Christ.

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It's going to be a mess here and there, but he's got us and we can walk out this awareness with our kids. In fact, the more we walk that out with grace and compassion for ourselves, our kids are going to see that and then model that themselves. Really, that is the greatest gift you can give your kids, for them to know themselves and understand that they have strengths and weaknesses. 

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They're going to have good days and bad days, and it is going to be okay. But, we do move forward and progress, learning about ourselves.

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Alison Cook: That's good. That's so good. It's not a linear line up. There's a lot of up and down, but we are moving in the right direction. I love how honest you are as a type nine. I think it's really relatable to so many women, what you were saying about wanting everybody to get along, wanting peace and harmony. 

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As you awakened, as you began to implement this growing awareness, how did it change how you showed up with your kids when they were fighting or when there was chaos or when there was turbulence? How did that change how you show up in those situations? Because like you said, I'm sure you still felt it. I'm sure you still got activated.

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Beth: Yeah, I'll give you a couple stories. Real quick stories. When they were little, Jeff would be wrestling with them on the floor. They were having so much fun, and my eyes are seeing how wonderful this is. But my body was screaming at me, you've got to put a stop to this because it was feeling chaos.

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My body didn't understand what was going on. It goes back to my own story. I was teased a lot as a little girl. So any kind of teasing or joking or playing or tickling meant to me, everything's on the verge of someone getting upset. So I had to understand that and watch my kids and literally mentally go, this is okay. Now, there were times I could stay in the moment, feel a little uncomfortable inside, but know that this is okay. 

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There were other times I had to literally physically remove myself because I wasn't in a place that could handle that. But I also didn't want to disrupt the fun that they were having. And then there's times where I can't remove myself and I'm in a really vulnerable place and I needed to ask Jeff to maybe stop for a while until I was in a better place and then they could go back to it. 

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That sounds really simple. But it's not–my typical way was shaming myself. They're having fun, why can't you be a good mom? Again, you have to go through that AWARE process. I had to receive and welcome and do all the things to understand that being activated wasn't a bad thing,

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Alison Cook: It's a great example because what's so relatable about what you share in the book and what you're sharing right now, is you would tend towards self-shame.

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Beth: I do. Yes. I would also blame others. If you would be happy, if you would not whine, I wouldn't feel so activated. Why can't you be a happy go lucky child? So it was both-and for sure.

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Alison Cook: Fair enough. Yeah. What I love is your honesty. What I love about the framework, the robustness of it, is it makes sense because this is what's so hard about this work of becoming more self aware. The enneagram and what you're doing in this book is such a helpful tool because it's complicated.

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You become aware of, I'm activated. And then, you ask what's really true. Is something outside of me happening that I need to address? Or in the case you offered, is what's happening outside of me really healthy? It's great for them. My kids are happy. They love it. I'm the one that's uncomfortable.

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That takes a minute to discern when you're activated. It's hard to do. There really is this whole process, and you can't even do that discernment if you're shaming yourself or blaming someone else. It makes so much sense, that it's really developing that posture. It's going to take me a minute. It's not simple. As you said, it's not simple.

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Beth: It's ongoing. So now that my kids are older, if we go out to dinner, my husband's a counterphobic six, which means he can be strong and blunt at times. And my son is a social six, but he's a young guy, so he can actually be a little provocative too, and my daughter's a two, and so she can bring in a lot of that strength of an eight.

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They at times have a lot of fun bantering, joking, sarcasm, or even debating their viewpoints, and they're having fun. They're okay, but everything in me, even as they're adults now, says the same thing for when they were wrestling on the floor. Because I can remember we were at the Cheesecake Factory one day and this was happening and I am feeling like we're on the verge of conflict or something bad's going to happen.

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I knew that there's times that I'm like, guys, please stop, and I'm not aware and I'm reactive, but in this one instance, I was like, okay, wait, and I remembered when they were kids. I go, guys, I am really physically uncomfortable right now. I am fearful. They were like, mom, because they grew up with the enneagram, mom, we totally get that. That makes total sense, but we're having a great time. We're totally fine. 

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I'm looking at all of them checking really? You're okay with this? They're like, yeah, this is great. I'm literally blown away. Now, I will say, I was like okay, I'm going to trust, I'm going to receive this, and then I'm going to try to engage in a new way. I tried to sit there for a little bit longer as they kept going, but I couldn't. So I said, hey, I'm trying really hard to let you guys be you, but I'm really struggling. Can we just change the topic or do something different?

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They were so kind and accommodating because they knew I was trying and they knew I could see what was true, but my body just, in my mind and my spirit couldn't align with the fun they were having. I feel very fortunate that they were able to move in my direction as well.

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Alison Cook: Gosh, this is so helpful. I'm listening to you going, especially with adult kids, because as they become older, it is different. There is a familial negotiation that can occur and it's so delicate. I know you read Boundaries for Your Soul and you really appreciate the parts. When you think about that family system where you're negotiating between parts, it's such a great example in your own family where you've got these adult kids who are like, we're having a blast. 

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You're like, this isn't fun for me. How do we negotiate it? There might be cases where you say, hey guys, I'm going to excuse myself. You go on. There might be situations where you can actually sit there and go, okay, I'm going to try to enjoy this. And then there might be situations where you're like, could we do something else. All of those three could be great options if everybody's very aware.

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Beth: I was doing a podcast with type nine moms and we were all laughing because back in the day, we didn't have these air pods with noise cancellation. So I would literally use those swimmer wax earplugs when I couldn't get away physically. I needed to be present and I would put those in halfway so it knocked the noise down a little bit. 

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Nowadays when they're bantering, and I want to still be there, I'll sometimes put the AirPods in to bring that volume and the intensity down so that my body can engage more than usual. There's going to be types where people out there that are like, that makes no sense at all.

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I get it, especially from a type nine. I can almost picture the other types going, that sounds like so much fun. Like type eights, they call it confrontational intimacy. They love that back and forth, that sparring. They feel intimate or connected with others. That scares me to death, but I'm also growing. Okay. How can I do that in a way that's good for me, but also helpful for others? 

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Again the whole point of the book is knowing yourself as a mom. How did God create you uniquely with your enneagram type, your story? And understanding that so that you are gracious and kind to yourself when you're at that place. You're able to move in a healthier direction and it's not linear. It's up and down. 

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I have been doing the enneagram for 20 some years now. I'm still struggling. We were talking about it before the podcast. I'm still in it. But there has been lots of progress and there's lots of progress to keep happening.

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Alison Cook: The real fruit isn't, oh, we never struggle. The real fruit is, we love each other. We're together. We're still having a blast together 20 years later. That's amazing fruit.

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Beth: Yeah. To know each other. So one last story. My kids were in their late teens and it was summer break. It was like the very first week of summer break and I worked from home typing away and doing a bunch of stuff. I came downstairs and when you come down the stairs in our last house, you come down the stairs and you walk through the hallway and it’s the kitchen island and sink.

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Okay. So I looked at it and I'm like, oh my. This is a disaster. I'm like, I did not do this. I'm trying to self-regulate. I'm like, okay, I'm gonna ask them to clean up. It's theirs. I did. They're like, yeah, sure, mom. they're in there playing video games, having a blast. They're kind of loud. I'm like, this is good. This is good. They're having fun. This is exactly what I want. 

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I said, hey, I'm gonna go upstairs and work, and then I'm gonna come back down and I'd like this done. Sure, mom. So four hours later, I came down. Yes, we all know the dishes are still there. As a type 9, we think that our presence doesn't matter. Our voice doesn't matter. That's what got me activated. 

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And why I'm sharing the story is when you can name the tendencies your type has, you can then treat it like a rumble strip on the highway. So when I was walking down that hallway towards the kitchen, I knew I was activated and everything in me wanted to be upset, to be hurt.

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Nobody cares. Nobody respects me. they're over there in there still having a ball. That is a dream to have teenage kids enjoying one another. So I'm in this very perplexed situation. I want to yell and scream and say, you guys should respect me, and that's a big thing for type nines.

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But then I felt the rumble strip. I gathered myself and I knew what was going on internally. I went in there and I said, hey guys, I asked that this be cleaned up four hours ago. Here's what happens when you raise your kids to be self aware and use the enneagram. They instantly got up. This isn't all the time, so please do not think the McCords are like this all the time. 

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But this was really beautiful. They got up and they came into the kitchen where I was. They said, oh, mom, yes, we just, we're total teenagers. We're so sorry. We didn't mean to. Just kept playing and totally forgot about time.

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This is where it got really creepy and awesome. They're like mom, we know as a type 9 you probably feel like your voice doesn't matter and that we don't love you. But that is not true and we'll totally clean it up. You totally matter to us. We got caught up in the fun. And I sat there, like is this really happening?

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I really felt seen and validated and cared for by them validating and acknowledging my viewpoint of the world. Not theirs, mine. It really helped me to go, I am loved. They understand what hurts me, they're apologizing, and I forgave them and we moved forward and they cleaned up the kitchen.

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That is why we want families to use the AWARE acronym along with the gospel along with the Enneagram, because we can do these hard things together and have a really great relationship, even when it feels turbulent. Good things can come out of it.

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Alison Cook: I love that. What age do you recommend kids, because I do think it can be so helpful as a family to have the language, what age do you recommend parents start talking about the enneagram with their kids?

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Beth: I think helping your kids understand the concept of the Enneagram, that different people have different colored lenses–there are plastic sunglasses out there and they're all different colors–helps them to understand that we all see the world differently. You can even start there. 

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We all have different things that make us happy or sad. So you can even start at a young age, with a common framework and understanding. But then to really find their type, we cannot name anyone's type. I know we all try to, and it's not wrong for parents to study their kids, to be curious, to have a couple of types in their mind, but please do not type your kids.

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Me and my team who are experts in the enneagram, we've all been like, oh my goodness, I think my kid is this, and then like another season in their life, the developmental stage, they’re like, wait a second, maybe they're this type. And then they change again. You're like, oh, maybe it's that type. That happens all the time. 

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So hold several numbers loosely. You might clearly see they're not several types, and that's great. Hold a couple numbers loosely. Keep introducing the concept of the enneagram, but do it usually in ways that you're not saying the words of the enneagram because even with my kids I had to be very careful to not annoy them.

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With the enneagram, make it an everyday conversation. Then when they're in their teens, that's when they're starting to become aware of themselves. This is usually when parents are freaking out because they're like, you haven't ever been this way in your whole life. It's because they were figuring out who they should be.

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They're like, should I be like that teacher? Should I be like that parent? They're not morphing, they're ebb and flowing in life. Then those teenagers, they’re like, I don't think so, I'm gonna be me. And then the parents are, oh my gosh, what's happening?

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That's when their personalities are solidifying. It's been there since birth, but it's really coming to fruition. So if they're interested, have them take an Enneagram test, look at the core motivations of all nine types, and see if they can find the one that has their core motivations.

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It might take time. It takes 40, 50 year olds time. It's okay. They might mistype themselves. That's okay too. But I would say it's in those teenagers that you can really start to see if they're ready and if they're interested in that. But it really has to be their process, their discovery, because it's about why they think, feel, and behave, not the outward behaviors.

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All kids can rebel, but why are they rebelling? That's the difference. All kids can be perfectionistic, but why are they being a perfectionist? So you want to get to the core motivation. So I want to let parents know it's great that you are curious. It is great that you are studying your kids. Do that, but hold them loosely until they can name their type.

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Alison Cook: I love that. That's so good. You can create that environment of awareness all throughout and then bring that tool in later on.

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Beth: One of the reasons why we don't want to type our kids really comes back to IFS. We have a book called More Than Your Number, which is a combination of IFS and the Enneagram. We call it the enneagram maternal profile. We use all nine types at different levels, different degrees.

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We have parts within us that show up. In your kids' parts, the different Enneagram types will pop up from time to time and confuse you. That's okay. That's why you gotta wait until they're old enough to really name the core reasons for why they think, feel, and behave.

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Alison Cook: Yeah, I love that. That's one thing you and I share in common, is that overlay with the different parts of us.  That's so good, Beth. So much wisdom here. It's such a good book. There's so much in it, practical stuff for moms. It really does come out of your own lived experience and you share a lot of that in the book. I've learned a lot listening today. I'm like, oh, especially with adult kids, you have to revisit all of that. Things land in a different way on our systems as they get older. 

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Where can people find you, find the book, and get more resources about how to apply this?

Give us all the scoop on how people can find you.

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Beth: So the book can be found at EnneagramForMoms.com. We have an assessment there for parents to take. So that's a really fun way to find your type. You can pre-order the book there or order the book there if it's already out. If it's a pre-order, you can get pre-order bonuses. There are lots of goodies that we put together that I wish I had when I was younger, so I really hope people will pre-order, get those PDFs to download, to use. 

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They are really important resources to have. So Enneagramformoms.com. Everywhere else, it's our website, YourEnneagramCoach.com, You can meander your way over to that website, Enneagram for Moms, or Your Enneagram Coach handles on social media, that's where we're at.

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Alison Cook: I always refer people to your Enneagram assessment. It's really a good one. It's really robust. It's free. You put in your email address. I'll link to all of that in the show notes. Your resources and your materials are amazing. They're super practical. They're all Christ centered, they're all steeped in biblical wisdom and really practical and helpful.

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I love that you're bringing this into parenting. I think it's so helpful. It's super helpful. We need tools in the toolkit and this is one of the most helpful ones, all the way around from the naming to the framing to the bringing that awareness into ourselves and helping our kids grow in that. Thank you so much for all the work that you do, Beth. It's really helped so many people and I'm thrilled about this new resource.

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Beth: I've thoroughly enjoyed it, and I will say once again, your books have been instrumental in my own life, so as much as I want them to grab this new book, I really want you guys to grab Alison's books as well. I am not kidding. They are great.

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Alison Cook: Thank you, Beth. I so appreciate you. I love the fact that even between the two of us, we're reflecting that wholeness, that fullness as we each create different ways of getting at deeper health and deeper wholeness. So thanks for being here today.

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Beth: Thank you.

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